Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

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Jay415
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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

Post by Jay415 »

ok Here's the results from my tests. looks like I'm gonna go with Contact Cement.
I haven't found the Helmsman Spar Urethane to be a problem at all. Holds to the wood well and glue sticks to it well. All test pieces were coated with 3 coats of Helmsman Spar Urethane letting each coat dry at least 8 hours and no sanding in between coats.

First test was with Roberts 6700 Outdoor Carpet Adhesive. I let it dry 3 days.
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Then I cut it in half
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The adhesive worked very well dry and I destroyed the carpet trying to pull it up and the backing stayed glued
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The other half I soaked in water for about 3 hours to simulate fishing in the rain all day.
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The Roberts 6700 soaked up water like a sponge.
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And the strength was compromised. It had slight resistance, but nothing like the dry test.
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One good thing is after letting it dry again the glue returned to the size and strength it was before. And the piece I peeled up re-glued itself down and the strength seemed to be just as strong as before.
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Then I decided to try Dap Contact Cement Original. Which also claims only to be water resistant.
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After coating both sides and letting them set up, adhesion was instant. Definitely no repositioning, but I knew that already. I have worked with it many times doing laminate. Dry strength was just as good as Roberts 6700 and would have destroyed the carpet and left the backing behind if I tried to remove it.
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Again I soaked this piece for about 3 hours to simulate fishing in the rain all day.
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After 3 hours soaking, the Dap contact cement is showing the same strength as when it was dry and the carpet backing is staying firmly attached to the plywood coated with Helmsman. Looks like Contact Cement is the Winner!
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Last edited by Jay415 on 08 Nov 2011, 21:25, edited 2 times in total.

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bobbyb
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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

Post by bobbyb »

Jay

That was one excellent and detailed test - Thank you for sharing =D> .

These results will eliminate any uncertainty in my mind when I re-deck (soon).

bobby

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Hanr3
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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

Post by Hanr3 »

The contact cement also adheres to outdoor enamel (oil based) paint, and the outside enamel paint is specifically designed to protect wood 24/7/365 for decades.

Excellent testing.
Check my sig for a link to my build that includes pictures of my paint/cement carpeted floor.

To save costs, check your local paint supplier for returned enamel paint. Color doesn't matter when the carpet will cover it.
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lbursell
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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

Post by lbursell »

Yay!!!!!!!!
I used the DAP to secure my bunk carpets last year. I've had no problems whatsoever and now your testing makes me feel even better. Thanks for taking the time to do the testing and show your results.
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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

Post by jigngrub »

The foam backing on carpet is the Devils lap dog! It's the weakest link in the carpet, glue, sealer application and helps retain any water/moisture that gets on the carpet.

You won't pull marine vinyl off like that when glued with cc.
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Jay415
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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

Post by Jay415 »

jigngrub wrote:The foam backing on carpet is the Devils lap dog! It's the weakest link in the carpet, glue, sealer application and helps retain any water/moisture that gets on the carpet.

You won't pull marine vinyl off like that when glued with cc.
True, but I'm not testing the strength of the carpet. I'm testing the strength of the adhesive. and if the carpet is pulled from the center not an edge, it doesn't separate like that.

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Jay415
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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

Post by Jay415 »

Ok after 32 hours of soaking the Contact Cement shows signs of failure. It did not separate on it's own though. It peeled of like a sticker. Unless the boat is submerged and I forget about it, Contact Cement should be fine. The white brush marks is the contact cement that was not covered by carpet and absorbed water.
Image

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Jay415
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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

Post by Jay415 »

I just found Henry 663 locally. So I'm gonna give that a try. It was recommended to me originally and many have used it with success. I just couldn't find it. Until now that is.

Directions say water resistant after 5 days and roll with 75 lb roller. Both of which I didn't do with the Roberts. Maybe it needed that? Who knows? Rolling would keep the glue thinner and maybe increasing strength. More is not always better.

I did have another thought though. One con of contact cement there is no resticking after wetness failure. The Roberts on the other hand restuck and regained strength after drying out. Once the carpet is down nobody's gonna be pulling on it to remove it. So I don't see any reason not to use Roberts either. I think it's now just down to preference of application and patience of time to properly setup.

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Jay415
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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

Post by Jay415 »

Henry 663 was the same as Roberts. Both are good and prob won't cause any problems unless you store your boat outside uncovered or fish a lot in the rain and don't let the boat dry out. These glues can't take heavy water for long periods.

I've decided to go with contact cement because it's an instant adhesion of the carpet after coating carpet and wood and letting them dry a 1/2 hour or so. Also I feel there will be less of a mess (no glue squishing out of the edges and such) and application is with a paint brush instead of a trowel.

My project is in my signature. I'll update as soon as work is picture worthy.

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Jay415
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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

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As I am getting ready to finally start carpeting. I went to my local hardware store that has everything! I always go there for those hard to find things. I never thought about looking for carpet adhesive there. Well as I'm waiting for the salesperson to fill my hardware order I took a stroll around the store and found the original glue I was looking for.

HENRY® 263 WeatherPro™
Outdoor Carpet Adhesive
https://www.wwhenry.com/content.aspx?id= ... =79&pID=84

Quoted from site:
Waterproof after two hours
Bonds To:
HENRY 263 WeatherPro Outdoor Carpet Adhesive bonds outdoor carpet and artificial turf to concrete, asphalt paving, abraded fiberglass substrates, roughened aluminum boat decks, and exterior- or marine-grade plywood decking
So it's made for what we are doing here!

Just for the hell of it I ran another quick test and it performed awesome!
Roberts and Henry's 663 absorbed water like a sponge after just 3 hours. I only let the Henry's 263 dry about 18 hours then soaked it in water for 14 about hours and it is the same as when it was dry! It repels water and is truly waterproof! Adhesion is great!

Henry's 263 dry time about 18 hours
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Henry's 263 after soaking in water for 14 hours
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This is what Roberts looked like after just 3 hours soaking in water
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So my final decision on adhesive is to use both Henry's 263 and Contact cement. I made the descision out of ease of use and quick adhesion.

I will use Henry's 263 on the surface then lay the carpet roll and let dry for at least 24 hours. Then I use contact cement for the edge wrap. Using both products for the best way they perform.

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Jay415
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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

Post by Jay415 »

Henry's 263 soaked for 5 days! Holding strong!
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blink
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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

Post by blink »

This is a great thread. I am definitely going to use the Henrys 263.

One question i had is, while reading the label on the Chapco (which is what they have at Lowes here), i saw that it said it not for use on treated or sealed surfaces.
So should i put my 3 coats of spar urethane on my plywood before carpeting, or not???

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Jay415
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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

Post by Jay415 »

They say that because they can't guarantee compatibility. I had no problem with 3 coats of spar urethane. All tests pieces were coated also. Adhesion is very good.

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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

Post by blink »

Jay415 wrote:They say that because they can't guarantee compatibility. I had no problem with 3 coats of spar urethane. All tests pieces were coated also. Adhesion is very good.
sounds good. Thanks!

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Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

Post by Lunatic »

This info couldnt have come at a better time. thanks.

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