Best deck waterproofing before gluing carpet??

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Jay415

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I am up in the air about what to use on my boat decks. I want to waterproof the plywood and all wood supports, but I also want to make sure I won't have an issue with the carpet glue adhering. I was thinking about using Minwax Helmsman Spar Urethane or Thompson's Water Seal. What"s the best to use? I was reading a container of outdoor carpet glue that said "not for water sealed surfaces" I think the brand was Chapco from Lowes. I read about and was recommended Henry 663 so I'll prob go with that unless someone can recommend better.
 
I used epoxy resin on the wood surfaces, top, bottom, and edges. I used the outdoor carpet glue from Ho Dep. All is adhering well.
 
I used the Minwax Helmsman Spar Urethane on all the wood in my boat, then I glued the carpet down with Roberts 6700 Premium carpet glue from Home Depot or Lowes.
 
Thanks I have to check out what Home Depot has. Lowes had the Chapco, which I don't feel comfortable with after reading the label. I prob stick with the Helmsman for sealing though.
 
When I did mine, I just bought some Thompsons Water Seal and did 3 coats on both sides of every piece of deck. Then I applied generous 5200 to all the edges of the plywood let it set for the recommended 7 days. Then I primed each piece top and bottom with 3 coats of an oil based outdoor wood primer which was designed to adhere to the Thompsons. Then came back with 3 coats of Valspar severe weather outdoor paint on each side. Then carpeted with dark gray outdoor carpet with rubber backing and used outdoor weather resistant glue, and stainless steel marine staples. Going on a year with absolutely no issues.
 
devilmutt said:
I used the Minwax Helmsman Spar Urethane on all the wood in my boat, then I glued the carpet down with Roberts 6700 Premium carpet glue from Home Depot or Lowes.
the Roberts 6700 got good reviews on HD's web site and a few of the reviewers used it for marine use. So hopefully they have it locally. I'll use that with Helmsman.
 
devilmutt said:
I used the Minwax Helmsman Spar Urethane on all the wood in my boat, then I glued the carpet down with Roberts 6700 Premium carpet glue from Home Depot or Lowes.
I was just going over your build, GREAT JOB! =D>
I was able to get Roberts 6700 locally so I think I'm gonna follow your lead with this one. Have you had the carpet subjected to heavy wetness at all? Like rain storms?
I am in the process of coating a test piece with Helmsman and then I'll glue a scrap of carpet to it. I don't see why I should have any problems though. I bought Satin finish Helmsman because I was guessing with more gloss, there would be more of a chance for glue not to stick. Like gluing to glass. What finish did you use? Do you think it even matters?

nosticks said:
I used epoxy resin on the wood surfaces, top, bottom, and edges. I used the outdoor carpet glue from Ho Dep. All is adhering well.
This sounds like it left a glossy finish so I guess I shouldn't worry about it. Did you use the Roberts 6700 also? That's the only outdoor carpet glue I saw at HD.
Did you sand or rough up the surface before gluing?
 
I did Helmsman Spar Urethane as well, mainly because I was copying what Devil did since I liked his build too :)
It turned out pretty well. I went through two of their smaller quart size cans, so I also bought a spray can urethane to go with it to help seal the sides and problem areas.
 
I used oil based paint and contact cememt.

3 years outside under a boat cover, oh and a few trips to the lake fishing, including numerous boat camping trips in the rain. Still like the day I built it.
 
Jay415 said:
devilmutt said:
I used the Minwax Helmsman Spar Urethane on all the wood in my boat, then I glued the carpet down with Roberts 6700 Premium carpet glue from Home Depot or Lowes.
I was just going over your build, GREAT JOB! =D>
I was able to get Roberts 6700 locally so I think I'm gonna follow your lead with this one. Have you had the carpet subjected to heavy wetness at all? Like rain storms?
I am in the process of coating a test piece with Helmsman and then I'll glue a scrap of carpet to it. I don't see why I should have any problems though. I bought Satin finish Helmsman because I was guessing with more gloss, there would be more of a chance for glue not to stick. Like gluing to glass. What finish did you use? Do you think it even matters?

nosticks said:
I used epoxy resin on the wood surfaces, top, bottom, and edges. I used the outdoor carpet glue from Ho Dep. All is adhering well.
This sounds like it left a glossy finish so I guess I shouldn't worry about it. Did you use the Roberts 6700 also? That's the only outdoor carpet glue I saw at HD.
Did you sand or rough up the surface before gluing?

I don't know if it matters, but I used the satin finish. I haven't had the boat out in any downpours yet, but I expect it to hold up well.
 
devilmutt said:
I don't know if it matters, but I used the satin finish. I haven't had the boat out in any downpours yet, but I expect it to hold up well.

Ok so I am using exactly the same as you. I did a test piece with 3 coats of Helmsman satin and glued a small piece of carpet to it with Roberts 6700. I called the company that makes Roberts and of course they recommend no water sealing prior to application. I'll let you know if a few days how my test goes. I'll prob cut the board in half and see how hard it is to rip the carpet off 1 piece and then soak the other for a day or so and see what happens.
 
It may be too late now, but the urethane is very weak compared to the epoxy resin... and they both cost about the same.

This is after 2 coats of epoxy:

DSC02217.jpg


Here's a link to best priced epoxy I could find on the web, they have fast shipping and great service.

https://www.uscomposites.com/epoxy.html
 
jigngrub said:
It may be too late now, but the urethane is very weak compared to the epoxy resin... and they both cost about the same.

This is after 2 coats of epoxy:

DSC02217.jpg


Here's a link to best priced epoxy I could find on the web, they have fast shipping and great service.

https://www.uscomposites.com/epoxy.html
not too late yet. I only did a test piece. I thought epoxy resin would be more difficult to work with. Don't you have to kind of float/spread it on rather than paint it on?
My test seems to be holding up well. I am going to soak it in water a few days to give it a good wetness test. I don't think it should preform much different. My only concern now is the glue rated as water resistant and not water proof.
I left some glue on the board which was not covered by carpet to see how well it sticks to the spar urethane. I know it's gonna stick to the carpet! That's what it meant for! :lol: The glue stays the consistence almost like very thick sticky chewing gum. So it's almost like if a piece pulls free it will restick itself with some pressure. I'll update after my water test.
 
I used Helsman Spar Urethane in my build. I bought a bucket of the Henry's Premium Outdoor Carpet Glue (because it was damaged and I got it for $5). I urethaned a piece of plywood and stuck a small piece of carpet to it. 3 days later after sitting in the sun, it peeled right back up. Then I read the back of the label and even called Henry. They said it would not stick to glossy surfaces. They said to lightly sand any glossy surface and it should work.

I didn't feel like sanding so I bought some cans of 3m High Strength Adhesive. It has worked for me so far.
 
Jay415 said:
jigngrub said:
It may be too late now, but the urethane is very weak compared to the epoxy resin... and they both cost about the same.

This is after 2 coats of epoxy:

DSC02217.jpg


Here's a link to best priced epoxy I could find on the web, they have fast shipping and great service.

https://www.uscomposites.com/epoxy.html
not too late yet. I only did a test piece. I thought epoxy resin would be more difficult to work with. Don't you have to kind of float/spread it on rather than paint it on?
My test seems to be holding up well. I am going to soak it in water a few days to give it a good wetness test. I don't think it should preform much different. My only concern now is the glue rated as water resistant and not water proof.
I left some glue on the board which was not covered by carpet to see how well it sticks to the spar urethane. I know it's gonna stick to the carpet! That's what it meant for! :lol: The glue stays the consistence almost like very thick sticky chewing gum. So it's almost like if a piece pulls free it will restick itself with some pressure. I'll update after my water test.

There's a thing about that, it's not just how well the glue sticks to the sealer... but also how well the sealer sticks to the wood.

I haven't found a waterproof glue yet, they're all water resistant... even the ones made especially for marine applications. This is one of the reasons I went with marine vinyl instead of carpet, it sheds water instead of absorbing it. Going with the vinyl will also cut way down on the mildew in the boat too, and that's a real good thing!
 
ok Here's the results from my tests. looks like I'm gonna go with Contact Cement.
I haven't found the Helmsman Spar Urethane to be a problem at all. Holds to the wood well and glue sticks to it well. All test pieces were coated with 3 coats of Helmsman Spar Urethane letting each coat dry at least 8 hours and no sanding in between coats.

First test was with Roberts 6700 Outdoor Carpet Adhesive. I let it dry 3 days.
IMG_2235.jpg


Then I cut it in half
IMG_2239.jpg


The adhesive worked very well dry and I destroyed the carpet trying to pull it up and the backing stayed glued
IMG_2243.jpg


The other half I soaked in water for about 3 hours to simulate fishing in the rain all day.
IMG_2245.jpg


The Roberts 6700 soaked up water like a sponge.
IMG_2247.jpg


And the strength was compromised. It had slight resistance, but nothing like the dry test.
IMG_2250.jpg


One good thing is after letting it dry again the glue returned to the size and strength it was before. And the piece I peeled up re-glued itself down and the strength seemed to be just as strong as before.
IMG_2262.jpg


Then I decided to try Dap Contact Cement Original. Which also claims only to be water resistant.
Dap-00272-rw-163696-228357.jpg


After coating both sides and letting them set up, adhesion was instant. Definitely no repositioning, but I knew that already. I have worked with it many times doing laminate. Dry strength was just as good as Roberts 6700 and would have destroyed the carpet and left the backing behind if I tried to remove it.
IMG_2252.jpg


Again I soaked this piece for about 3 hours to simulate fishing in the rain all day.
IMG_2253.jpg


After 3 hours soaking, the Dap contact cement is showing the same strength as when it was dry and the carpet backing is staying firmly attached to the plywood coated with Helmsman. Looks like Contact Cement is the Winner!
IMG_2264.jpg
 
Jay

That was one excellent and detailed test - Thank you for sharing =D> .

These results will eliminate any uncertainty in my mind when I re-deck (soon).

bobby
 
The contact cement also adheres to outdoor enamel (oil based) paint, and the outside enamel paint is specifically designed to protect wood 24/7/365 for decades.

Excellent testing.
Check my sig for a link to my build that includes pictures of my paint/cement carpeted floor.

To save costs, check your local paint supplier for returned enamel paint. Color doesn't matter when the carpet will cover it.
 
Yay!!!!!!!!
I used the DAP to secure my bunk carpets last year. I've had no problems whatsoever and now your testing makes me feel even better. Thanks for taking the time to do the testing and show your results.
 
The foam backing on carpet is the Devils lap dog! It's the weakest link in the carpet, glue, sealer application and helps retain any water/moisture that gets on the carpet.

You won't pull marine vinyl off like that when glued with cc.
 

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