Add YOUR voice to the Federal Ethanol Mandate - Comment now!

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Hanr3
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Post by Hanr3 »

I guess I have a different experience with e-fuels. I fill my tank up in the fall, add oil and Stabill, let it sit all winter (November to March) and run that tank of gas all summer. Fill up again for the winter and repeat. Only time I burn more than one tank of gas a year is when I make trips to Canada or other big bodies of water. Two years ago I went to Canada in August/Sept. This year it was Eagle River Wi in July. Maybe the oil mixed in the gas tank prevents phase separation?

I run an Evinrude 40hp 2 stroke.

Ethanol also has the benefit of cleaning out the gum and varnish gasoline leaves behind. Some people blame the ethanol when they change from straight gas to ethanol. The problem is the ethanol is removing the varnish built up in the carb and in some cases will plug the jets causing issues. The issue is a dirty carb, not ethanol.
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beetlespin
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Add YOUR voice to the Federal Ethanol Mandate - Comment now!

Post by beetlespin »

I add Stabil Marine to my 5 gallon jugs every time I fill them up. Never had any issues. I had to replace the gas line from my tank to the motor but it was 10 years old.

Crazyboat
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Post by Crazyboat »

No way I want E gas in anything I run, let alone my boat.

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LDUBS
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Post by LDUBS »

The way things are going out here, I'm more worried about getting any gaso, blended or not. Calif gov mandated only electric vehicles to be sold in 15 years. Nuts.

They already talking about how the thousands and thousands of jobs lost will be installing solar. Double Nuts.
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C&K
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Add YOUR voice to the Federal Ethanol Mandate - Comment now!

Post by C&K »

We have not seen the problems with ethanol blended fuel that some people believe it has, especially at 10% blends. Ethanol has replaced the oxygenates (MTBE) and octane boosters in reformulated gasoline. It is a cleaner alternative.

Henry Ford ran his first horseless carriage in 1896 on pure ethanol because motor gasoline did not exist then. All the buses and trucks in Sweden are diesel with engines built by Scania, but run on ED95 - 93.6% ethanol, 3.6% ignition improver, and 2.8% denaturants - these engines are super-clean running and have 10x less harmful emissions than the same engines fueled with petroleum diesel fuel. In Brazil there are over 27 million cars that run on pure (E100) ethanol.

The advantage with ethanol-fueled engines is that it is high octane and can run compression ratios up to 15:1, which is in the diesel engine range. As a result a pure ethanol-fueled engine can be more thermally efficient than gasoline.

Ethanol has replaced 10% of the petroleum gasoline in the United States, but there is not enough domestic production to do much more than that at present. It can be made from any biomass thru the fermentation process - you can make it in your backyard shop with a simple still (assuming that would be legal - and it is with the appropriate motor fuel license).

The only thing driving the petroleum industry is money, and lots of it. But in the future, if internal combustion engines are to still be viable they will run on fuels other than gasoline - and ethanol is one of those since it is a carbon-neutral fuel. Current ethanol production in the US has a net energy return of 1.31 - 1 energy input unit yields 1.31 energy units in ethanol fuel. In Brazil where they use sugarcane for the feedstock the net energy return is closer to 8. So the full potential of ethanol as a carbon-neutral motor fuel has not yet been realized.

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maintenanceguy
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Add YOUR voice to the Federal Ethanol Mandate - Comment now!

Post by maintenanceguy »

Bart wrote: 25 Aug 2017, 09:47 Done. The whole idea is crazy. The energy required to boil alcohol out of sour mash just seems counter productive.
It's not about efficiency or the environment. ADM, the world's largest agricultural company lobbied for ethanol in fuel so they could sell more corn. Big corn producing states got behind it demanding that their senators and congressmen push the EPA to require ethanol to prop up corn prices. Like most laws and regulations that come out of DC, politicians are passing laws (or demanding regulations) so they can get campaign money from the people who make money off of the law or regulation. Just the normal process of selling votes to the highest bidder.
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C&K
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Post by C&K »

maintenanceguy wrote: 03 Oct 2021, 20:28 ADM, the world's largest agricultural company
Archer Daniels Midland is not the world's largest agricultural company. Cargill is.

Cargill is an American privately held global food corporation based in Minnetonka, Minnesota, and incorporated in Wilmington, Delaware. Founded in 1865, it is the largest privately held corporation in the United States in terms of revenue. If it were a public company, it would rank, as of 2015, number 15 on the Fortune 500, behind McKesson and ahead of AT&T

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cargill

Agriculture, food processing and distribution is the single largest industry on earth, far larger than the global oil industry. It is just not incorporated under one umbrella on the stock exchanges. Ethanol is actually a win for everybody - the starch is used to make ethanol, which supplies 10% of our gasoline supply, the protein-rich byproduct called distillers grain goes to the beef and pork industry so you can all enjoy hamburgers, steaks and pork chops. Corn is the largest and most important crop on earth in terms of gross tonnage for the world's food supply, and is the world's most-produced grain. Wheat is #2.

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MN Fisher
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Post by MN Fisher »

C&K wrote: 04 Oct 2021, 10:07
maintenanceguy wrote: 03 Oct 2021, 20:28 ADM, the world's largest agricultural company
Agriculture, food processing and distribution is the single largest industry on earth, far larger than the global oil industry. It is just not incorporated under one umbrella on the stock exchanges. Ethanol is actually a win for everybody - the starch is used to make ethanol, which supplies 10% of our gasoline supply, the protein-rich byproduct called distillers grain goes to the beef and pork industry so you can all enjoy hamburgers, steaks and pork chops. Corn is the largest and most important crop on earth in terms of gross tonnage for the world's food supply, and is the world's most-produced grain. Wheat is #2.
And new plastics - I worked in IT at Cargill Headquarters...while I was there, Cargill Research Division in cooperation with DOW Chemical developed a plastic that uses the remains of corn-milling...stuff they use to throw away.

It's the basis for that biodegradable plastic that's starting to become popular.

It was developed back in 1998...tells you how long things 'sit on a shelf' before coming to market.

C&K
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Post by C&K »

MN Fisher wrote: 04 Oct 2021, 12:41 And new plastics - I worked in IT at Cargill Headquarters...while I was there, Cargill Research Division in cooperation with DOW Chemical developed a plastic that uses the remains of corn-milling...stuff they use to throw away.
Oh, Cargill is huge.

Cargill reports revenues of $114.695 billion and earnings of $3.103 billion in 2018. Employing over 166,000 employees in 66 countries, it is responsible for 25% of all United States grain exports. The company also supplies about 22% of the US domestic meat market, importing more product from Argentina than any other company, and is the largest poultry producer in Thailand. All the eggs used in US McDonald's restaurants pass through Cargill's plants. It is the only US producer of Alberger process salt, which is used in the fast-food and prepared food industries.

Sue Cargill used to be our neighbor for many years before she passed away in 2010. The McMillan and Cargill families still own the company and Sue served on the Board for 10 years before she passed. It was always said that when Sue wanted something done she'd make a phone call direct to the governor at the State Capital and it got done, no arguments, no questions asked.

The U.S. has not realized even a fraction of the billions of gallons of ethanol we could produce. The U.S. produced 17.3 billion gallons, which is 1.1 million barrels per day, of ethanol in 2020. The U.S. exported 1.33 billion gallons of it to 90 countries on all six inhabited continents on earth last year. It is not a small industry.

BernieP
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Post by BernieP »

Funny thing is I just changed jobs and now I rely on ethanol in gasoline for my paycheck. But I still don't want it in my old 2 stroke or in something that will sit for a long time. Luckily we still have one place in town we can get ethanol free gas.