Question about painting

[Douglasdzaster]

Hello everyone. Several months ago I removed the floor in my 1982 Monark 16/52. Under the plywood was corrosion. I spent several hours stripping it to bare aluminum and abatement. Afterward I just used an aluminum polish instead of paint so I could keep an eye on it. Its still clean and shiny and no more corrosion so it’s time to do something. And do it on a budget. I bought a gallon of Rustoleum bed liner and wanted to prime it first. So I found Rustoleum Zinsser bulls eye 1-2-3 primer. Says it’s for any surface including aluminum. When I got home I decided I wanted to etch the boat first. I have some Krud Kutter metal clean and etch for paint prep. It also says it’s for aluminum. Self etching primer is $10 a can and I’d need 6 or 7 so that’s out.
Ive searched everywhere and can’t find where anyone has used these products together on a boat. So I figured I’d ask you wise and experienced folks your opinion. Should I go ahead with my plan? On I’m putting a floor over the bed liner afterwards.

 

[GTS225]

T'were me, I think I'd just scuff the area you wish to paint with some 120 grit and a sander. You're after some "tooth" for the primer to get a decent hold on the hull. That's all etching would do, anyway.
Break out the orbital and the sanding discs.

Roger

 

[Douglasdzaster]

T'were me, I think I'd just scuff the area you wish to paint with some 120 grit and a sander. You're after some "tooth" for the primer to get a decent hold on the hull. That's all etching would do, anyway.
Break out the orbital and the sanding discs.

Roger

I appreciate the reply. I wish I would have seen it sooner. I started the other day.
I had to get pretty aggressive when I removed the old coating and I left the it where I could still see all the sanding scratches planning to paint it down the road.
It would have been easier to hit it with the orbital again. But the Krud Kutter metal clean and etch did get it cleaned.
It was evening and I started putting down the primer and it didn’t want to stick. I’d lay down some with a brush stroke and if I kept brushing to even it out it came off leaving a thin layer that looked splotchy.
Temperature was in the 60’s and humidity was just below the threshold they give you. When it started getting dark I stopped working and started picking up. I grabbed my IR gun and checked the surface temperature and the aluminum was 52 degrees. I had really messed up by painting that evening.
I let it sit most of the day yesterday nice and sunny 70 plus degrees and 45% humidity. I rubbed the thin film with my finger and it didn’t come off. I have some spots where I had left it thicker and they seemed soft. I got some 500 grit sandpaper and sure enough if I sanded to much that thicker area peeled off. I grab the primer and painted it on the rest that had the film. And it went on like it was supposed to and was drying like it was supposed to.
The plan now is to peel off the other area and redo it if the humidity comes back down. It’s cloudy today. I’m hoping the coat I did yesterday is strong.
Other wise I may be getting out the pressure washer and starting over and that’s going to make a mess the admiral won’t like.

 

[DaleH]

Ugh, painting an dealing with humidity su#ks! If anything like working with epoxy in such conditions, WAIT until after the hottest part of the day and temps have begun to cool … before applying

 

[Douglasdzaster]

Ugh, painting an dealing with humidity su#ks! If anything like working with epoxy in such conditions, WAIT until after the hottest part of the day and temps have begun to cool … before applying

I finished the primer but I’m going to wait several days for full cure time then see if it scratches off before I go any further. If it comes off I’ll strip it back down and sand the heck out of i. I was aggravated with it and thought about doing an epoxy.

 

[LDUBS]

Simply out of curiosity, what is the benefit of putting the bed liner on in an area that will be covered by the deck?

 

[Douglasdzaster]

Simply out of curiosity, what is the benefit of putting the bed liner on in an area that will be covered by the deck?

It was cheaper and I figured it would be a little stronger and be better for noise than just paint. I saw it one day and just grabbed it. The storage under the rear seat and behind it will just be bed liner. This is my first rebuild heck it’s my first tin boat so I’m learning a lot as I go.

 

[LDUBS]

It was cheaper and I figured it would be a little stronger and be better for noise than just paint. I saw it one day and just grabbed it. The storage under the rear seat and behind it will just be bed liner. This is my first rebuild heck it’s my first tin boat so I’m learning a lot as I go.

Thanks. I don't know much about the stuff myself so thought I would ask.

 

[TexasJim]

Douglas: Historically, aircraft builders used zinc chromate primer on their aluminum parts and structures. My boat was built in 1958, and still has some of the zinc chromate on it. I didn't bare metal any area that had good primer. It's kinda greenish yellow. I doubt yours has any. The bare metal was cleaned, degreased, etched with an acid, then the zinc chromate was sprayed on. True zinc chromate was found to be a carcinogen, so normal folks can't get it any more. Spray can zinc chromate isn't the true stuff. I bare metalled most of my boat's hull, then etched it with two vinegar washes, rinsed with water. I let it dry in the sun, then sprayed on the Martin-Senour zinc chromate primer I got from NAPA. It took two cans to spray my 14' boat's hull. And, I didn't do most of the bottom, as the original primer was still there. I used Tractor Supply Majic spray can paint for the color coats. It's been on there for 2-1/2 years, dunked in saltwater a couple of times a week, and is holding up fine. I just hose the boat off when I get home. The picture in my post about my flats skiff conversion was taken a couple of months back. That process worked well for me. YMMV

 

[Douglasdzaster]

UPDATE: Current situation. I put the last coat of primer (Zinsser 1-2-3) on 4 days ago. I lift the cover this morning and it looked good and was dry but I was able to scratch with my finger nail and chip it off to bare aluminum. The humidity has been up to 100% down to 45% depending on what time of day. Temperature has been with in range. But there’s just been a lot of moisture in the air this week. My plan was to top it Saturday because of good weather that day. It’s supposed to really storm here tomorrow.
Im wondering if it’s the weather and I should go ahead as planned Saturday or if I have bad adhesion and need to strip all the primer off and start over with a different primer?
Oh and the truck bed coating says on the can to prime any bare spots but the application kit says it doesn’t need a primer.
I don’t know which direction I’m going in. I’m lost as a goose.

 

[Douglasdzaster]

Douglas: Historically, aircraft builders used zinc chromate primer on their aluminum parts and structures. My boat was built in 1958, and still has some of the zinc chromate on it. I didn't bare metal any area that had good primer. It's kinda greenish yellow. I doubt yours has any. The bare metal was cleaned, degreased, etched with an acid, then the zinc chromate was sprayed on. True zinc chromate was found to be a carcinogen, so normal folks can't get it any more. Spray can zinc chromate isn't the true stuff. I bare metalled most of my boat's hull, then etched it with two vinegar washes, rinsed with water. I let it dry in the sun, then sprayed on the Martin-Senour zinc chromate primer I got from NAPA. It took two cans to spray my 14' boat's hull. And, I didn't do most of the bottom, as the original primer was still there. I used Tractor Supply Majic spray can paint for the color coats. It's been on there for 2-1/2 years, dunked in saltwater a couple of times a week, and is holding up fine. I just hose the boat off when I get home. The picture in my post about my flats skiff conversion was taken a couple of months back. That process worked well for me. YMMV

I may end up stripping what I’ve done and take a loss. Starting over would it be better to use todays zinc chromate or zinc phosphate primer seems to be popular?

 

[DaleH]

I'd just proceed with painting, as long as truly dry and without excessive humidity. Zinser makes good products and Rust-OLeum even sells that '1-2-3' primer under their name, next to Zinser brand name. I find modern primers to be like that sometimes, fragile-like without the top coat on, where one could scrape it off. Remember, you're going to paint over it and that 'fluid film' should cure as one.

Check your can, R-O recommends painting with the humidity < 85% otherwise drying can be affected.

 

[Douglasdzaster]

I'd just proceed with painting, as long as truly dry and without excessive humidity. Zinser makes good products and Rust-OLeum even sells that '1-2-3' primer under their name, next to Zinser brand name. I find modern primers to be like that sometimes, fragile-like without the top coat on, where one could scrape it off. Remember, you're going to paint over it and that 'fluid film' should cure as one.

Check your can, R-O recommends painting with the humidity < 85% otherwise drying can be affected.

Thank you sir, I was worried I didn’t prep correctly or the humidity we have had ruined it. After to the next two days are supposed to be nice. If the humidity is right I’ll apply the Rustoleum bed coating tomorrow and let them cure together.

 

[Douglasdzaster]

Today was a good day to paint. I took the cover off the boat and then primer was solid. It just needed more time. Thank you DaleH. I had some other things to take care of so I got a later start than I wanted. I got the first coat of truck bed coating applied with the roller. Went to wher I started and started trimming with a couple of brushes which took a while. The can says coverage of 140’to 160’ square feet. I call bs. Im doing 63 square feet. And have less than 1/2 a gallon left. I applied it thick enough to just cover. There’s white dots where the primer didn’t get covered. It’s sure looking good though. I’m going to get a quart tomorrow. That along with what’s left should make a second coat which is all I need since I’m covering it anyway. So anyway just thought I’d share some good news. I’ll post a picture tomorrow.
Thanks to everyone that replied to my post on here. When it comes to my boat build this is my go to place. Especially since this is my first tin boat.

 

[Douglasdzaster]

Well it’s done and will be sitting with the cover for a week curing. Supposed to have a chance of rain everyday. I had a humidity window of 4 hours today and finished. Humidity started at 95% then down to 65% at 1:00 pm. It dried like it was supposed to and what I done yesterday was solid. Took measurements so I can start building the floor I want.
Here is a picture so far it’s not a perfect job but I’ll be repainting the rest of the boat. I was excited and took the picture before removing the tape.
Its come a long way from the corrosion and pitting. It took several hours to remove what ever coating it had down to bare aluminum. Then I started abatement off the corrosion. A lot of it done with a Dremel.

 

[Douglasdzaster]

Another question.
Has anyone used Total Boat penetrating epoxy on new plywood? This is my first experience with epoxy. I want to make sure I’ve ordered enough. I’m doing the floor 52”x10’. The product says it can be thinned to penetrate better. I ordered a half gallon.
EDIT: I found a coverage chart. It looks like I’ll have enough and if I’m careful I’ll be able to cover the front deck too which is next.
Thanks everyone. I couldn’t find a chart before I posted the tried a different search and there it was.

 

[Douglasdzaster]

DaleH I wanted to thank you for your help. You helped me through the corrosion 7 months ago. I wouldn’t have got it all if you hadn’t told me to get out the magnifying glass and why.
And instead of stripping the primer and starting over I kept painting like you said. Today I couldn’t scratch the surface. It’s solid and ready for the floor.

 

[LDUBS]

Another question.
Has anyone used Total Boat penetrating epoxy on new plywood? This is my first experience with epoxy. I want to make sure I’ve ordered enough. I’m doing the floor 52”x10’. The product says it can be thinned to penetrate better. I ordered a half gallon.
EDIT: I found a coverage chart. It looks like I’ll have enough and if I’m careful I’ll be able to cover the front deck too which is next.
Thanks everyone. I couldn’t find a chart before I posted the tried a different search and there it was.

I've used it. I thinned with acetone or DNA (can't remember which). Coverage was pretty good. Mix up small amounts at a time. Their site has some helpful videos worth watching.

 

[DaleH]

If you have to mix up a bit more than a small batch, use a BIG/WIDE container, like an 8" by 10" foil pan, but still only like 1/2" deep! For if you put that same amount in a 'bucket' to mix it, it will cook off and could set itself on fire or just smoke and cook away! Ask me how I know ...

 

[Iammichael6499]

Just in case anyone else is considering painting bare aluminum I recently used “Raptor Anti-Corrosive Epoxy Primer” inside my Lowe 1860. No etching necessary but it does need a scuffed up surface. I rolled it on vs spraying. Cleaned the surface with acetone prior to rolling. After priming I sprayed “Raptor Protective Coating, Tintable” which requires a hardener and is in essentially a bed liner without the grit. I wanted a lightly textured surface so I set the gun at 50psi and the compressor at 90psi. Only vertical surfaces, console and live well were painted. The weather went south on me so I won’t finish painting the areas around the hatches until this coming spring.