5HP Gamefisher Question/w/pics/UPDATE 10/30/08

[phased]

ben2go I finally received an e-mail from Rupp Parts on parts availability on your gamefisher. I sent you a PM with the info.

 

[ben2go]

ben2go I finally received an e-mail from Rupp Parts on parts availability on your gamefisher. I sent you a PM with the info.

Got it.Thanks.

 

[ben2go]

I wanna thank those for posting up and helping me locate parts suppliers.Luckily I haven't needed parts so far.Well except for a spark plug.I haven't gotten the engine running yet.There is really no reason it shouldn't run unless the compression is way down.I am looking for a fuel valve.Mine leaks so bad that I know the engine's pump can't get fuel to the carb.Fuel just runs out past the shut off knob's stem.I tried Rupp Parts and they don't have the correct valve.I am waiting to hear back from Discount Marine.The problem with using an alternative valve is the way the lower shroud is made.The valve drops down from the inside and has a nut that holds it in place on the outside.Problem is the valve is on a perch that causes 2 problems.1) the valve has to point straight up because it's so close to the carb connection 2) the stem for the knob is really long, so the knob will barely hang down past the bottom of the shroud.It's hard to get a finger or 2 on it to turn the valve off.Then it still leaks like crazy.I'll have to say, the knob is protected, but it's stem still got bent.Here's a pic.Maybe I will get a pic of it on the motor.

Here we go.

Here's the fuel valve mounting location.Notice how it raises the valve up.It puts the top hose barb real close to the carb hose barb.

Here's what the valve looks like.I am searching for one.It's upside down in this pic.The knob should be on bottom.

 

[phased]

I have never seen a valve like this before but being a mechanic I am prone to be a repair before replace kind of guy. That said it looks like the valve body and needle shaft are made from brass? If it were mine I would remove the knob (set screw or pressed on I do not know) then remove the needle shaft via the nut. Place the shaft on a block of wood and use a plastic (soft face) hammer and softly tap the needle while rolling it until it is straight. Be gentle so as not to flatten the shaft. I have repaired many bent carb needle valves like this. It looks kind of corroded so be sure and soak it before trying to take it apart.
A product by Wechem called Infinity is the best penetrating oil I have used in the over thirty years I have been a mechanic. I was introduced to it 8 years ago when I changed from an auto mechanic to forklifts. It works a lot faster than anything I have used before. Everything on a forklift that is left outside tends to be rusted.

Disclaimer: I am not associated with Wechem in any way I just think it is a great product...LOL

 

[ben2go]

The nut holds the valve in the cowl.The unit can't be disassembled.The stem for the knob is bent down inside the valve body.Being a former mechanic,my first thought was to disassemble it and try to attempt a repair.I don't understand how it goes together unless it's pressed together.There's no way to remove the needle assembly threw the top and the barbs are part of the valve body.I'm at a loss on this one. :?


ADDED PIC

 

[SVNET]

Good to see another 5HP gamefisher...

That one quite looks like mine but not exact. Interested to see how you make out.

I got all my carb / fuel pump parts from DISCOUNT-MARINE-PARTS.COM

They seems to have everything for my 5HP Gamefisher.

Sherwood the guy I talk to when I call is always right on point, very dry guy but knows his stuff.

I strongly recommend them, reasonable prices, fast shipping and good stock on hand...

Take care.

 

[ben2go]

Mine is a 1980 Eska Gamefisher produce from 79 to 81.I don't know why, but these years are very different from the early Gamefishers and the later Force/OMC built motors.Good thing is the power head being made by Tecumseh.Carb and ignition parts are easy to find.Older push mowers used simular carbs and the same ignition parts.

 

[phased]

Man I understand your loss here. Since I have never seen one I can not quite understand what part the knob is turning from the pics. In the last pic posted am I seeing two orifice holes where the fuel passes from the intake barb and out? Could you post a pic with all pieces laid out in order of dis assembly? Maybe that will jog my instincts.

I just found this info:https://www.certifiedpartscorp.com/
Eska
In 1988, Certified Parts Corporation purchased the Outboard Motor and Trolling Motor divisions of Eska. For many years, Eska private labeled their product for companies such as Sears, J.C. Penny, Western Auto and Montgomery Wards. Certified Parts Corporation continues to purchase and assemble most of the major repair components for the Eska units. Certified Parts Corporation stocks repair parts for horsepower models 2 hp. through 15 hp. Also, 2 lb. thrust through 36 lb. thrust trolling motors

 

[ben2go]

Here is the best pic I could get.It's dark out for me to get a good one.This shows how the valve fits in the cowl.Just imagine the green line as the edge of the cowl if it where cut away.Notice how the base would fit inside the hole the valve hangs out of.This prevents me from using an off the self plumbing valve.The valve has to be closed when the external tank is used.If it's not closed, the fuel pump will suck air through the internal tank,preventing fuel from being pumped to the carb from the external tank.I know it's confusing.

 

[phased]

man I am sorry for all the ?'s but still trying to figure this out. In the pics it looks like the knob screws on the shaft? You said "fuel just runs out past the shut off valves stem", is the stem what is actually moving in and out? Does it screw in and out or push/pull in and out? Just wandering if maybe it has double threads? You know, screws out so far then if you pull slightly then unscrew more another set of threads engage and will screw out. I just can't figure why the manufacturer would make it a press fit.
I realize you probably know more about this than I do just trying to put thought in a different direction.

 

[ben2go]

The valve is like a standard pin valve.Screw in for off and screw out for on/open.Here is what I found out.The stem or shaft was threaded into the valve body,then a rubber seal was added to the stem/shaft with lubricant.Next the valve was placed into a fixture/jig and pressed to seal the stem/shaft into the body.Then the outside was threaded for securing to a mount with a nut and lock washer.I think I have found a new valve.I will be calling to order it tomorrow.I'm hoping it's the same but with the ability to remove the stem/shaft to replace the O ring seal.Thanks for all the help.I understand what you mean by double threads.Once the shaft is backed out as far as it can go,then a threaded insert backs out revealing the valves inner workings.Unfortunately,this valve isn't made that way.If it was I could machine a new brass stem/shaft.

 

[phased]

Keep us posted on the new valve. Hope it works for you.

 

[ben2go]

Keep us posted on the new valve. Hope it works for you.

I will.Thanks.

 

[ben2go]

This is a small update.I found or rather Discount Marine found me a new fuel valve.He assures me that it is an exact replacement or money back no questions asked.I'm starting to like this Sherwood guy I keep dealing with at Discount Marine.Any way,looks like a may need to add $19.95+S&H to my total money spent.The valve should be here Monday or Tuesday.I was assured that it would ship Friday morning.I can't wait.

 

[phased]

Congrats on your find. I know that is a load off your mind.

 

[ben2go]

Congrats on your find. I know that is a load off your mind.

Thanks and yes it is.Now when I get it running I gotta locate a good 3 gallon plastic fuel tank,line,and female coupler.I got the male coupler.It's bolted to the lower cowl pointing out next to the tiller arm.If this was a big motor that I leave on the boat,I'd skip the connector and run the line straight to the carb.Most tanks have a connector between the tank and fuel line.I remove and store my motor,in my building, after every use.Keeps the neighbor crack heads from walking off with it.

 

[dedawg1149]

Congrats on your find. I know that is a load off your mind.

Thanks and yes it is.Now when I get it running I gotta locate a good 3 gallon plastic fuel tank,line,and female coupler.I got the male coupler.It's bolted to the lower cowl pointing out next to the tiller arm.If this was a big motor that I leave on the boat,I'd skip the connector and run the line straight to the carb.Most tanks have a connector between the tank and fuel line.I remove and store my motor,in my building, after every use.Keeps the neighbor crack heads from walking off with it.

i got better ways to keep them from walking away with my stuff

 

[ben2go]

I own a few fire arms and most of them know it, since I shot a crack head.I caught one breaking in my house I own next door.It was around midnight.Soon as he jimmyed the door open,I put one in his knee, and jumped on him.We hit the ground and he was in to much pain to fight back.I had hit the emergency speed dial button and laid the phone down,when I jumped on him.My phone has speaker phone option,and the dispatch operator and I could hear each other.The police got there and hauled him away.He was wanted for other thefts,so they didn't bother grilling me.Since this, I have installed more security/street lights.I was luck I seen him coming up the side road.That gave me enough time to slip out my back door,behind my building,and to the corner of the house closest to where he would walk up.I thought he would come around back but he went right up to the front door.He was desperate.

 

[ben2go]

UPDATE

Turns out the guy at Discount Marine has the same useless valve that everyone else keeps selling me.So,I gotta send it back.
Here is some new pics to show exactly what the problem is.The guy at discount marine said I may have to drill the hole over size for it to work but it will not work.A local valve company said that they may be able to build me a valve or modify an exsiting valve to work.The price is way off at a minimum of 50 dollars.

Here is the original valve installed in the lower cowl.It recesses so far into it that I can't use a substitute.I really wish I could.

Here is how it sits on it's pedestal inside the cowl.The lower cowl is aluminum.If it was plastic,I could cut the pedestal down,and remelt everything to look factory.

Here is the valves side by side.This should help explain my issue a little better.

 

[dedawg1149]

you cant just drill a hole in a new location and mount it?maybe run longer fuel hoses