Battery Selection and APH

TinBoats.net

Help Support TinBoats.net:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

monzster

Well-known member
TinBoats Supporter
Joined
Oct 6, 2020
Messages
68
Reaction score
41
Location
23069
LOCATION
Hanover Virginia
YOUTUBE
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJFyieuyma55o5iA4x2Cqmg and
I have a 14' Jon and a 10' Quest Angler. Both are run with the same trolling motors which I just transfer from boat to boat. A Pexmore 55 thrust which I use in the rear and a 30 thrust Minn Kota in the front. Each boat has their own set of batteries which are lead acid. The Jon has 2 100APH and the Quest 2 80APH both are run in parallel. The Jon has one battery that is going bad and is only 2 years old. I only fish in places that allow electric power. 2 years ago I was on a reservoir in the Jon and ended up running out of juice and had to paddle back to the dock since then I have been fishing rivers only which is not a big problem but want to get back to some reservoirs. I cannot have this problem again because I have back and mobility issues but am trying not to give up fishing at this point. I will also be fishing alot by myself this year. So my question is. Im looking to go with Lithium instead of lead acid because I just cant afford to keep replacing them every 2-3 years (thats what I have been getting out of them between the Walmart brand and now Duracell brand) now because we are a one income family now with me not working because of my back. I am thinking of buying one 100APH Lithium to run both of these motors for about 6 hours on the water if that is possible. If not would it at least run the rear motor for that long and have a 100APH lead battery to run the front motor in addition to the 100APH lithium running the back until I could afford another Lithium. I usually run both motors to get where I am going then the front just to fish from spot to spot in that general area. Appreciate any input and any certain brand of Lithium you like better over others.
 
I have a 14' Jon and a 10' Quest Angler. Both are run with the same trolling motors which I just transfer from boat to boat. A Pexmore 55 thrust which I use in the rear and a 30 thrust Minn Kota in the front. Each boat has their own set of batteries which are lead acid. The Jon has 2 100APH and the Quest 2 80APH both are run in parallel. The Jon has one battery that is going bad and is only 2 years old. I only fish in places that allow electric power. 2 years ago I was on a reservoir in the Jon and ended up running out of juice and had to paddle back to the dock since then I have been fishing rivers only which is not a big problem but want to get back to some reservoirs. I cannot have this problem again because I have back and mobility issues but am trying not to give up fishing at this point. I will also be fishing alot by myself this year. So my question is. Im looking to go with Lithium instead of lead acid because I just cant afford to keep replacing them every 2-3 years (thats what I have been getting out of them between the Walmart brand and now Duracell brand) now because we are a one income family now with me not working because of my back. I am thinking of buying one 100APH Lithium to run both of these motors for about 6 hours on the water if that is possible. If not would it at least run the rear motor for that long and have a 100APH lead battery to run the front motor in addition to the 100APH lithium running the back until I could afford another Lithium. I usually run both motors to get where I am going then the front just to fish from spot to spot in that general area. Appreciate any input and any certain brand of Lithium you like better over others.
Sorry, not your guy for a specific answer, but I just researched the Lithium Bats to save weight on my boat. I really think there's no reason to go wet cell at this day and age. Get online and look up lithium battery teardowns on youtube and you'll see some big differences in the build quality between the cheaper ones. From watching these vids and some reading, seems Li Time and Watt Cycle bats are acceptable build quality and almost too affordable. Both are on Amazon too. I'm thinking lithium may be worth every penny. Especially, if these battery's last as long as they're supposed too. And the 100 percent cycle rate. I'm tired of buying new bats every 2-4 years too. So, I just bought the Watt Cycle mini 100Ah w/bluetooth for 179 bucks. Its a calculated risk. If you fish in real cold weather, or leave the bat out in freezing weather you might not want a mini (different cell type). Also if you plan to ever charge your bat from an alternator, make sure the lithium battery supprts that. We'll see how mine works out once the ice breaks up here in SW Colorado!
 
Care and maintenance is not being done properly is why your life is short. I have a pair of Wally world gp 31 deep cycle batteries bought in 2019 and starting to show a loss of charge now. My last set lasted for over 5 years. They can't be run below 50-60% capacity at any time, they must be recharged at the end if the day. Leaving the battery discharged for days or running it below 50% will definitely shorten life of the battery..No natter what brand, you can get a bad one on ocassion.
 
Care and maintenance is not being done properly is why your life is short. I have a pair of Wally world gp 31 deep cycle batteries bought in 2019 and starting to show a loss of charge now. My last set lasted for over 5 years. They can't be run below 50-60% capacity at any time, they must be recharged at the end if the day. Leaving the battery discharged for days or running it below 50% will definitely shorten life of the battery..No natter what brand, you can get a bad one on occasion
Maintenance is not the issue for sure but you are correct, in my 43 years of being an auto mechanic I have replaced a battery or 2 under warranty for sure.
 
https://www.amazon.com/s?k=TimeUSB&crid=18582P81AXYMQ&sprefix=timeusb

These are very good batteries, last much longer than regular, are lightweight, and don't require the careful maintenance that lead acid batteries do. There are a number of choices on that search page. Some are simple, and others have more features. At this price, I would have bought the bluetooth versions, but it's not necessary.

The basic100 AH batteries should easily last you a full day on a lake. For about $159, they don't cost much more than a Walmart battery. I use mine to fish the CBBT and also lakes here in VA. A simple choice to make, in my opinion.

This is the $25 charger I purchased, and it's worked well. I have two, since I need to charge multiple batteries:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BN1W15D6
 
With lithium batteries, you do NOT charge at the end of the day. They like to rest at 30-60% charge, so you only top them off the night before a trip.

Less to think about after a long day on the water.
 
Sorry, not your guy for a specific answer, but I just researched the Lithium Bats to save weight on my boat. I really think there's no reason to go wet cell at this day and age. Get online and look up lithium battery teardowns on youtube and you'll see some big differences in the build quality between the cheaper ones. From watching these vids and some reading, seems Li Time and Watt Cycle bats are acceptable build quality and almost too affordable. Both are on Amazon too. I'm thinking lithium may be worth every penny. Especially, if these battery's last as long as they're supposed too. And the 100 percent cycle rate. I'm tired of buying new bats every 2-4 years too. So, I just bought the Watt Cycle mini 100Ah w/bluetooth for 179 bucks. Its a calculated risk. If you fish in real cold weather, or leave the bat out in freezing weather you might not want a mini (different cell type). Also if you plan to ever charge your bat from an alternator, make sure the lithium battery supprts that. We'll see how mine works out once the ice breaks up here in SW Colorado!
I have heard alot of good things about LiTime. I have also found that for the price of what a lead is you can get a lithium for just a few dollars more. The warranty is also a plus on alot of them and like you said the weight which is another main reason for me. Its like a win win for sure.
 
With lithium batteries, you do NOT charge at the end of the day. They like to rest at 30-60% charge, so you only top them off the night before a trip.

Less to think about after a long day on the water.
This I did not know. So use to topping off after the trip with leads. Appreciate the info on this as well as the batteries and charger. Will definitely look at those. Thanks again.
 
With lithium batteries, you do NOT charge at the end of the day. They like to rest at 30-60% charge, so you only top them off the night before a trip.

Less to think about after a long day on the water.
Will it hurt them to top them off at the end of the day and/or leave them on a trickle charger? My ADD self will 100% forget to hook them up the night before at some point and wind up with dead batteries in the middle of the lake. However, if hooking them up as part of the “put the boat up” routine, I’m much less likely to forget.
 
It is a bit of retraining after many years of using LA batteries. Mine do not have a heating pad, so early and late season, have to make sure it doesn’t go below freezing when charging them.
 
Maintenance is not the issue for sure but you are correct, in my 43 years of being an auto mechanic I have replaced a battery or 2 under warranty for sure.
Perhaps a bad charger or something must be wrong if you only get a couple years from a deep cycle battery. Over my 60 plus years of boat ownership, even my cheap deep cycle batteries lasted longer than two years. I also use a "maintainer" thru the winter storage period which has added life to my batteries.
 
Will it hurt them to top them off at the end of the day and/or leave them on a trickle charger? My ADD self will 100% forget to hook them up the night before at some point and wind up with dead batteries in the middle of the lake. However, if hooking them up as part of the “put the boat up” routine, I’m much less likely to forget.
In what little research I have done. I think that is ok to do as long as the battery has a BMS (battery management system) built into it and a battery maintainer is used. When storing it over the times when not used for an extended amount it should be charged only around 50%. Possibly someone with more knowledge or has used them can confirm this. I take research from the Google with a grain of salt.
 
In what little research I have done. I think that is ok to do as long as the battery has a BMS (battery management system) built into it and a battery maintainer is used. When storing it over the times when not used for an extended amount it should be charged only around 50%. Possibly someone with more knowledge or has used them can confirm this. I take research from the Google with a grain of salt.
It absolutely WILL reduce the life and capacity to store them charged or to leave them on a charger that doesn't shut off. Leaving a lithium battery in its highest energy state does degrade them. Now, if you fish every other day it's likely not a big deal. If you get out once a month it is. Best habit is to hook them up the night before you go out.
Note that the degradation isn't huge and if you're an occasional fisherman leaving one charged for a week or two isn't going to kill it. You likely won't notice a difference. But you definitely don't leave them hooked to a trickle/maintainer all winter.
Most manufacturers will suggest somewhere between 30% and 70% charge, aiming at 50%, is the best storage condition. You don't have to obsess over it but you don't want to make storing at full charge a habit.
 
Will it hurt them to top them off at the end of the day and/or leave them on a trickle charger? My ADD self will 100% forget to hook them up the night before at some point and wind up with dead batteries in the middle of the lake. However, if hooking them up as part of the “put the boat up” routine, I’m much less likely to forget.
YES, that can reduce life. They come with a 5 year warranty, but still.

I understand. I had to deprogram myself, but it's a SO much easier only charging for an hour or so before heading out.

The lithiums have so much capacity that my problem is leaving too much power in them, NOT having them go dead. So often, I don't charge for several trips.
 
As far as the LA batteries, I've always kept at least one boat for freshwater that's solely powered by a trolling motor since NJ bans gas on freshwater. Its been that way as long as I can remember.
I run an older Minn Kota 3hp trolling motor. They've always been the most bang for the buck power wise. Early on I ran AC Delco deep cycle batteries but somewhere around the late 90's they started to go downhill. I ran a pair of group 27 batteries and the boat got used weekly as long as the water wasn't frozen. I would get 2 good seasons out of a pair of batteries and after that they began to loose run time. When not in use they were kept on a multi battery Minn Kota deep cycle maintainer that would charge and keep them ready at all times. The boat lived in a garage when not in use.

Fast forward 35 years and the same set up, although rebuild a few times, had trouble making it through a full day of fishing with two new Group 27 batteries and I've tried them all since the AC Delco battteries changed in the mid 1990's or so.
The same rated battery weighs less than it did back then and gives me about a 1/3 of the run time that the old batteries did. The motor still draws the same amps but the batteries seem week.
I tried a new trolling motor but the new trolling motor draws more power and is far slower. I could fish for two days on a charge on two batteries than now I'm lucky to get four hours of run time.
 
It absolutely WILL reduce the life and capacity to store them charged or to leave them on a charger that doesn't shut off. Leaving a lithium battery in its highest energy state does degrade them. Now, if you fish every other day it's likely not a big deal. If you get out once a month it is. Best habit is to hook them up the night before you go out.
Note that the degradation isn't huge and if you're an occasional fisherman leaving one charged for a week or two isn't going to kill it. You likely won't notice a difference. But you definitely don't leave them hooked to a trickle/maintainer all winter.
Most manufacturers will suggest somewhere between 30% and 70% charge, aiming at 50%, is the best storage condition. You don't have to obsess over it but you don't want to make storing at full charge a habit.
Appreciate the knowledge!!
 
As far as the LA batteries, I've always kept at least one boat for freshwater that's solely powered by a trolling motor since NJ bans gas on freshwater. Its been that way as long as I can remember.
I run an older Minn Kota 3hp trolling motor. They've always been the most bang for the buck power wise. Early on I ran AC Delco deep cycle batteries but somewhere around the late 90's they started to go downhill. I ran a pair of group 27 batteries and the boat got used weekly as long as the water wasn't frozen. I would get 2 good seasons out of a pair of batteries and after that they began to loose run time. When not in use they were kept on a multi battery Minn Kota deep cycle maintainer that would charge and keep them ready at all times. The boat lived in a garage when not in use.

Fast forward 35 years and the same set up, although rebuild a few times, had trouble making it through a full day of fishing with two new Group 27 batteries and I've tried them all since the AC Delco battteries changed in the mid 1990's or so.
The same rated battery weighs less than it did back then and gives me about a 1/3 of the run time that the old batteries did. The motor still draws the same amps but the batteries seem week.
I tried a new trolling motor but the new trolling motor draws more power and is far slower. I could fish for two days on a charge on two batteries than now I'm lucky to get four hours of run time.
I had one of those 3HP when I got my first jon boat it came with it. That was a great motor. Still wish I had it but the magnets came loose and I didn't know ow how to fix it at the time.
 
As far as the LA batteries, I've always kept at least one boat for freshwater that's solely powered by a trolling motor since NJ bans gas on freshwater. Its been that way as long as I can remember.
I run an older Minn Kota 3hp trolling motor. They've always been the most bang for the buck power wise. Early on I ran AC Delco deep cycle batteries but somewhere around the late 90's they started to go downhill. I ran a pair of group 27 batteries and the boat got used weekly as long as the water wasn't frozen. I would get 2 good seasons out of a pair of batteries and after that they began to loose run time. When not in use they were kept on a multi battery Minn Kota deep cycle maintainer that would charge and keep them ready at all times. The boat lived in a garage when not in use.

Fast forward 35 years and the same set up, although rebuild a few times, had trouble making it through a full day of fishing with two new Group 27 batteries and I've tried them all since the AC Delco battteries changed in the mid 1990's or so.
The same rated battery weighs less than it did back then and gives me about a 1/3 of the run time that the old batteries did. The motor still draws the same amps but the batteries seem week.
I tried a new trolling motor but the new trolling motor draws more power and is far slower. I could fish for two days on a charge on two batteries than now I'm lucky to get four hours of run time.
Dude.... Click on the link and order one. You will NEVER go back.
 
I had one of those 3HP when I got my first jon boat it came with it. That was a great motor. Still wish I had it but the magnets came loose and I didn't know ow how to fix it at the time.
All the motors they sold back then that had the 'Maximizer' circuit built in were the way to go. I've been hoarding and rebuilding them for years. Most of the 3hp motors I find now are extra long shafts but I've started to cut those down to a short shaft. I did save a few in case I ever find a deal on a small pontoon boat but that's not likely around here.
Around my way everyone killed them in saltwater.
If you look at the later years of that design they made the Riptide RT3.1 which was pretty much the same motor but with a carbon fiber shaft and epoxy bedded circuit board.

Most modern trolling motors use a separate set of windings to create different speeds.
The Maximizer was a 'pulse' control type system were rather than burning off the excess power to slow the motor down through a series of resistors it used a transistor circuit to turn the power on and off at full voltage as needed to turn the motor at the requested speed.

The magnets coming unglued were all that ever went wrong with those motors. I completely destroyed my first one not realizing what was going on. The thing started to draw more current and I kept going till it wouldn't move anymore. The result was a can full of magnetic dust and a shredded armature. They were still fairly common back then and I bought a used one, the magnets were still in place on that one so i turned a wood plug to fit on the brush side of the motor which I could use to position the magnets with, I then worked the magnets loose, sanded off all the original glue, and reattached them with JB Weld using the wooden jig I made. I've since redone over 200 of them but haven't run into one in a while lately but I've got a few more to redo if I ever get around to it including a 4hp/24v model in all chrome for an anniversary edition.

A lot of people scrapped their older trolling motors because parts were always outrageously expensive and nearly non existent through Minn Kota but if you have a good automotive electric dealer or rebuilder a good bit of that motor comes from a similar starter motor The armatures can be rewound if a good used one can't be found, brushes can be matched up from a generic assortment and the rest us basic electronics.

Years ago someone gave me an all stainless steel trolling motor, it was branded 'Old Pal'. The motor and controls were cooked and had filled with water and were pretty much destroyed but the bracket and shaft were built to be indestructible.

I gutted the control head and using two smaller Minn Kota 35lb thrust motor units on a two into one adapter I welded up, I mounted both side by side on the stainless shaft running two of the early style Lexan type props.
I then copied the Maximizer circuit from the 4hp and ran the two motors off a pulse control circuit at 24v.
After the first test run I realized it was too hard to steer with the foot long tiller handle. At first I just made a longer tiller but that wasn't much better so I went to a stick steer and cable that gave me more leverage over the two motors. I thought about running the one motor in reverse but there's no reverse prop options made for a trolling motor and having one made would be too expensive.

Power wise it was brutal. Part of the issue I was having was that the two motors were flexing the shaft and creating binding in the pivot bushings on the stainless mount and shaft. I added two Torrington bearings to the thing that helped but they were never going to last being wet all the time despite heavy grease.
I eventually converted it back to one motor and ran that unit on a 12ft glass runabout at 12v as more of a toy.
I gave the set up to an elderly neighbor for her pedal boat a few years ago.
 

Latest posts

Top