Lithium battery - worth the expense?

[thill]

Does your 2.5 HP motor even have a starter???

If if does, get a standard cranking battery for it. A lawnmower battery is probably all you will need for a motor that small.
LiFePo batteries aren't made to charge from an outboard.

 

[senkosam]

Hand-crank starts when it does, which is not often. Guess I've been trying to restart it like a 2-stroke and flooding it. Mostly has sat in the garage since I got it Dec. 2021 which is why a 12v is so important.

 

[Buster]

As Still Afloat says, a good Li battery is well worth the money, especially if you're using it a lot. All the benefits touted are real. I have a 100Ah one for trolling and love it.
I'd add that some of the cheaper are made with "seconds" cells that will not have the cycle life of the best quality, although like SA said, that doesn't mean you have to buy the most expensive to get something good. The cells are all made by the same couple companies, and the assembly into a battery is done by the same couple Taiwanese or Chinese companies, with a shell or sometimes just a decal being the only difference. The better ones have better battery management circuits, tighter QA on the cells, and bells and whistles like built in heaters.
They also take a little more care in storage. A lead acid battery is best stored on a trickle charger. Lithium is best stored around 50% charge. Let it go "dead" and you may not be able to recover it. Store it topped up and you'll eventually lose max capacity. That doesn't mean you can't charge it after a weekend of fishing and have it ready for next weekend, but if you're storing it over the winter it's best to run it down to about 50%.
Regarding cold weather use, I've run and charged mine at temps in the 30s and haven't noticed any issues.

 

[CRS]

I went with LI 5 years ago and have never regretted it. I have 3 lakes within reasonable drive and all are electric only. I have a ELCO 9.9 48 volt on the back a 24 volt minnkota ultera on the front and a hummin bird solex 10 fish finder. 2 48 volt 96 amp hour Dakota lithium for the back 2 12 volt 100 amp hour up front and 12 volt 7 amp hour for the hummer, electric steer and trim. I have had zero problems with any. The reduction in weight gives more than just maneuverability, less weight the boat moves easier reducing power consumption. Li batteries can be discharged down to 10% or lower depending upon the manufacturer. I do limit my discharge to 20% for safety concerns. After a day of fishing using the Ulterra constantly (I mostly troll) except for travel my batteries take about 6 hours to charge. The restriction on charger amps is not to over the amp hour figure of the battery. The rear motor gives me just over 2 hours run time at 75%. You will find with any battery running at 100% power kills them fast, you may go faster by a mile/hour or so but not nearly as far. Electric only boats are a pain in the butt compared to gas, I do not have a choice. With lithium I go faster and farther for a longer time. My 2 cents worth

 

[senkosam]

Dang, you two should get a commission as convincing and educational when it comes to Li batteries!
(No way did I forget everyone else's contributions.)
But I don't want to take only price into consideration, which seems crucial when choosing one. But $300 +/- is a lot to pay for a small boat used in mostly small lakes.

 

[airshot]

One of the key things about Li batteries is use !!! If you use them frequently, the cost is easily justified, but if used only on ocassion then probably not worth the expense. I have been researching them a lot, talking to actual users and have a couple friends in the battery making business. My conclusion is...if you use them at least once a week, then they are well worth the cost, if you have a small boat where weight is critical, then they are worth it. Myself...the jury is still out..I try to get out a couple times per week, I know, retirement is great....but many times it is for a joy ride, no trolling motor needed, fishing once per week weather permitting, I have spot lock instead of an anchor so TM is used a lot and also for trolling. So I am almost in the " use it enough to make it worthwhile group" ...so still deciding.
As long as my current 4 yr old batteries work well I will hang on, but when it comes time to replace them...still thinking..but I need three of them ..OUCH....gonna hurt !!

 

[senkosam]

My bass boat required three batteries: two deep cycles for trolling and the livewell for holding tournament bass and one for starting - the last one charged by the motor. They all lasted quite a while and the t.m. batteries did well on a tandem charge We're not talking huge lakes or river fishing far from the launch (like some that traveled more to spots than they fished).
Now that I don't do tournaments, I can fish mostly small county and state park lakes that don't allow gas plus I never troll for fish. Depth maps, either gov. or my own, allow me to know where structure is along with a depth finder to cue in on depth changes.

So whether I'm using a 30# or 55# thrust t.m. getting to spots slowly, it doesn't matter - knowing patterns and pattern locations, are. No Hudson R. or Greenwood L. fishing for me; the closer and less visited waters by others, the better. Doubt I'll be paying more for Li.

 

[Still Afloat]

As lead batteries become more expensive and lithium become less expensive the price difference will soon be minimal. When the lifetime is taken into consideration lithium deep cycle batteries are already less expensive in the the long run.

It‘s probably still a toss up on the lithium cranking batteries with the primary advantage being weight.

Off topic but, I was pricing out a bigger bottle of Argon today. Man that stuff has gone up in the past few years!

 

[Skunked again]

As lead batteries become more expensive and lithium become less expensive the price difference will soon be minimal. When the lifetime is taken into consideration lithium deep cycle batteries are already less expensive in the the long run.

It‘s probably still a toss up on the lithium cranking batteries with the primary advantage being weight.

Off topic but, I was pricing out a bigger bottle of Argon today. Man that stuff has gone up in the past few years!

It’s looking like lithium will be in my boat when the current (pun intended !)SLA’s give up the ghost.

At work we feed chlorine gas. 2 years ago it was $.29 per pound. Now, it’s back down to a $1.04 per pound, had a high of $1.12 per pound.

 

[LDUBS]

As lead batteries become more expensive and lithium become less expensive the price difference will soon be minimal. When the lifetime is taken into consideration lithium deep cycle batteries are already less expensive in the the long run.

I sure like the weight savings. I'm hoping that by the time my TM battery needs to be replaced the LI battery prices will be way down.

 

[Still Afloat]

Me too. I really like the flat discharge curve. At 50% discharge a Lithium battery still feels almost like a full charge while a lead battery would start to feel a bit sluggish. I borrowed this comparison of discharge curves from the kokanee addict fishing forum.

 

[Steph Boeker]

As lead batteries become more expensive and lithium become less expensive the price difference will soon be minimal. When the lifetime is taken into consideration lithium deep cycle batteries are already less expensive in the the long run.

It‘s probably still a toss up on the lithium cranking batteries with the primary advantage being weight.

Off topic but, I was pricing out a bigger bottle of Argon today. Man that stuff has gone up in the past few years!

Sounds like you might be welding aluminum ? I'd like to be able to do that but have no experience in welding. I've done some brazing and find that it's a precise endeavor. I bunrt through the transom lip in one spot and got better over time.
Now I'd like to remodel my alum 14'x54" and am thinking about learning alum. welding w/a small Eastwood 180 mig w/ spool gun. I guess I'm wondering about a lot, like would this be a likely start, how much practice might it take, is welding .060 or 090 even possible or would I need .125 ??
Any thoughts appreciated,
Thanks for your generous consideration,
Sincerely ..............

 

[FuzzyGrub]

For the battery I use on the electronics, can confirm that is the type of discharge profile.

What I have been watching for is how much pounding can they take in a boat, and if there have been cases of fire.

 

[Still Afloat]

I’ve welded steel for many years but, new to welding aluminum. Picked up a Syncrowave 200 TIG several years ago from friend that needed the cash. Haven’t had a project for it until now. Got a Millermatic 211 and Spoolmate 150 last week just in case TIG is too big of a first step into Al welding. So the bases should be covered as far as gear. Will do some practice welds in the next week before touching an arc to the Jet Jon project.

A guy at the local Airgas supply house says if you can breathe you can be a welder with the new auto-set machines. I already knew what, I wanted so he wasn’t trying to sell me. We’ll see how it goes.

Anyway, this is off-topic from batteries so we should launch a new thread if we want to talk welding.

 

[Steph Boeker]

I’ve welded steel for many years but, new to welding aluminum. Picked up a Syncrowave 200 TIG several years ago from friend that needed the cash. Haven’t had a project for it until now. Got a Millermatic 211 and Spoolmate 150 last week just in case TIG is too big of a first step into Al welding. So the bases should be covered as far as gear. Will do some practice welds in the next week before touching an arc to the Jet Jon project.

A guy at the local Airgas supply house says if you can breathe you can be a welder with the new auto-set machines. I already knew what, I wanted so he wasn’t trying to sell me. We’ll see how it goes.

Anyway, this is off-topic from batteries so we should launch a new thread if we want to talk welding.

I'd like that. I'm new here but think I'd find plenty of info offered on the subject of "Alum. Welding For Beginners".
Thanks for your generous consideration,
Sincerely ..............

 

[Still Afloat]

I‘ll have plenty of questions too.

 

[Still Afloat]

For the battery I use on the electronics, can confirm that is the type of discharge profile.

What I have been watching for is how much pounding can they take in a boat, and if there have been cases of fire.

It really boils down the packaging that holds the cells. If there are protrusions, wear points or an inadequate volume to accommodate swelling as the cells age, then the risk of a thermal problem increases. I think most battery manufacturers have this part of the equation under control.

One of the biggest issues is charging. Using a poorly designed charger or just using the wrong type of charger increases risks. AND… charging a battery at or near it’s maximum rated capacity isn’t a good idea on a regular basis.

 

[senkosam]

charging a battery at or near it’s maximum rated capacity isn’t a good idea on a regular basis.

Even deep cycle Pb batteries? I keep mine on a trickle charge after full charging.

 

[FuzzyGrub]

Even deep cycle Pb batteries? I keep mine on a trickle charge after full charging.

My LA batteries get fully recharged right after each outing. I don’t leave them on the charger in trickle mode. During winter, will charge them every two months. They generally last me 5 years or more.

 

[Still Afloat]

Sorry, that didn’t come out quite right. I meant the charge rate. High charge rates create unnecessary heat. Sure, you want to fully charge the battery.